WHEN DID YOU RECEIVE YOUR V&C? WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THEM?

[fredmiracle]

Am I the only guy that likes the changes made to the Constitution, mostly the cut outs for the upper deck cannons and tight fit for the ship to base?

I'll give my opinion on the Victory whenever Ares decides to send the one I ordered with my Kickstarters.

I like it, I think it looks good. It simply didn't strike me as any quantum leap from the other ships, more like a bit of extra TLC.

The pegs were a nice change, except that in the past I got into the habit of corkscrewing the ships off the base, so now I feel I'm definitely at risk of snapping the peg off if I forget. Luckily there's no need to flip the card, so I shouldn't be removing the ship very often...

[Diamondback]

I do have to dismount my ships regularly for storage, and Old Ironsides got a bent (luckily, easily reset) mizzen because of how solidly the peg holds. Thinking I need to file it down a little...

[Naharaht]

My H.M.S. Victory and U.S.S. Constitution models arrived safely yesterday (Monday) afternoon.

[Walram]

Dominic, they're pretty close--we've always Built Bigger, in fact our first few 74's were similar length and beam to a British First Rate.

Length on Gundeck: Constitution 174' 10", Victory 184' (note: this does not include spars, beakhead, overhang at bow/stern beyond ends of gun deck)
Beam: Constitution 43' 6", Victory 51' 7.5"
Burthen: Constitution 1576 tons BM, Victory 2162 53/94 tons BM

Just for comparison, an Elizabeth class British 74 (mid-stage Slade Common) is 168' 6" x 46' 10", 1612 88/94 tons BM; the first 74 commissioned into USN, Independence, was 190' 10" x 54' 7"--essentially a British First Rate with one less gun deck in size, and one shudders to think of how we might have one-upped in the Three Decker game.

The difference between Constitution and Victory would be about 3mm length on gundeck, about 2.5mm beam.

@csadn: QC = factory = China, not Italy.

With your comments on size, I'm surprised you didn't mention the USS Pennsylvania (1837). (A little outside of the time frame, but still a wooden sailing ship.)

[Diamondback]

Dave, I figured that was enough whipping it out and having a Mine's Bigger Than Yours Contest for one day. :) LOL

[TexaS]

Some say size doesn't matter, it's the weight you pound with...

[Popsical]

I tend to think of the Constitution and her like as similar to the Graf Spee in WW2. Outfight anything she cant outrun, outrun anything she cant outfight.
Perfect for the two respective navies of their time. With no foreign holdings to worry about they can operate this way with little to lose and lots to harrass.
Not so much use to the British Empire tho, there the need to hold the seas after action required a different breed of ship.

[Tiberius]

Ahh, the Graf Spee! Such a interesting and under told story. Yes, I have always thought of the Constitution like a pocket battleship also!

[David Manley]

I tend to think of the Constitution and her like as similar to the Graf Spee in WW2. Outfight anything she cant outrun, outrun anything she cant outfight.

Nice idea, but even at the time the heavy cruisers were built it wasn't really true and it became less so pretty quickly through the 30s

[csadn]

Ahh, the Graf Spee! Such a interesting and under told story. Yes, I have always thought of the Constitution like a pocket battleship also!

Except the US one *worked*. >;)

DB: Yeah -- and one of these days Ares will figure this out, and move production someplace where the Chinese can't f*** it up.

[Diamondback]

Lemme throw one question out: What percentage higher price would you be willing to pay for a Western-sourced Ares product? Because as long as all people see is raw cost, cheap Third World slave-labor wins with the penny-pinchers every time.

[Gunner]

I have no Idea of the difference between Chinese vs Euro/U.S. prices, but I think most Naval gamers would pay an extra 15 to 20% without raising an eyebrow.

[TWR]

I have no Idea of the difference between Chinese vs Euro/U.S. prices, but I think most Naval gamers would pay an extra 15 to 20% without raising an eyebrow.

For what? Why do you think there will be a better or worse product that is made elsewhere. Almost everything is made in Asia these days, including plastic buckets. I'm just not sure how a change in production location will change the product quality or availability.

[Gunner]

Glass accountability regarding production problems, a much faster delivery and response time, knowing the money is going into a USA/Euro not Chinese economy to mention a few.

[Diamondback]

And, oh by the way, people who won't eat the Penalty Clause for Breach of Contract with a smile and blow you off when one of the 800# gorillas of consumer-goods makes them a better offer for YOUR already contracted-and-paid-for production slot.

[TWR]

Glass accountability regarding production problems, a much faster delivery and response time, knowing the money is going into a USA/Euro not Chinese economy to mention a few.

I'm afraid knowing the money is going to U.S. company is not that important to me. Though I do trust that the workers that are producing the models are being paid a good wage in whichever country is important, at least to me. In general I am pleased with the models produced. I just wish distribution to New Zealand was greater. None of the recent releases can be sourced from local retailers.

I look forward to being able purchase the most recent releases, even though it will be by mail order...

[Popsical]

No sign of my Victory from the anchorage store yet. My prosperine from Gunner took a week from Arizona to Blighty.
My daughter was a little upset when it arrived first. Fingers crossed.

[Gunner]

My daughter was a little upset when it arrived first. Fingers crossed.

Don't quote me but, I've heard that the release date for retailers is May 4th. (next Monday)


PS In the past, I've had pre-orders arrive on the release date, depending on the company.

[fredmiracle]

Yes, May 4 is the announced date.

I wouldn't expect it to be shipped before then. My personal experience has been that in the past online retailers often sent pre-orders to ARRIVE on the release date, but (I believe in response to pressure from manufacturers) in recent years everything I've pre-ordered has been SHIPPED on the release date.

[Bligh]

No sign of my Victory from the anchorage store yet. My prosperine from Gunner took a week from Arizona to Blighty.
My daughter was a little upset when it arrived first. Fingers crossed.

Mine was shipped four days ago, so it should not be long now Steve.
Bligh.

[Popsical]

Oops should have stated mine was shipped a while ago. Not complaining i may add.
Cheers all.

[csadn]

Lemme throw one question out: What percentage higher price would you be willing to pay for a Western-sourced Ares product? Because as long as all people see is raw cost, cheap Third World slave-labor wins with the penny-pinchers every time.

Depends on where it's being built -- look up "farmshoring" (find someplace in the US "so far up the holler they have to pipe in oxygen", where the cost-of-living isn't f***in' ludicrous; have the minis assembled/painted there).

[Olsen]

Got my V & C yesterday from Keith. Everything fine, as always, when ordering from the aerodrome. Ship models look nice, but i don't see a leap in quality, when comparing them to the regular ships.
Nice and secure packaging from Ares though and the extras (captain cards) are a welcome and beautifully designed addition.
Overall, pretty much, what i had hoped for.

[Gunner]

Miniature Market shows them in stock for $19.44

[Popsical]

Got my daughters Victory today! Fantastically packaged by keith at aerodrome. Wonderful model and packaging.
Thanks to all, my daughter is ecstatic.

[Northern Wolves]

USS Constitution 1797 (1798)
Burden: 5
Deck: L
Veer: 5
Hull: 353, 343, 343, 233, 232, 222, 121, 121, 111
Crew: 4,4,4,4,3,3,2,2,1
Musket: 3,3,2,2,2,2,1,1,1

USS Constitution 1797 (1812)
Burden: 5
Deck: L
Veer: 5
Hull: 464, 454, 353, 353, 343, 232, 232, 222, 111
Crew: 4,4,4,4,3,3,2,2,1
Musket: 3,3,3,2,2,2,1,1,1

There was nothing structurally different about the hull between the two year models. This is odd, 1798 should be of the 464 variety as well. White Oak planks over Live Oak frame timbers (without spacing between frames and 5x as dense as English Oak, as opposed to the large 'room and space' framing of British ships) were in the ship from launch.

Still waiting patiently...

[Diamondback]

Mike, there was a *huge* armament weight difference, though. As-built was a throw of 588#, Aug 1812 over-gun with carronades was throwing 881#; by contrast your typical British Common 74 normally only threw 781#, and at her 1783 peak Victory was throwing 1328#. For a gain of almost half-again the throw weight and only bumped up a point each slot... well, she might even be a little handicapped--given that many French Temeraires were throwing 904# I think a case could have been made to give 1812 a Max Broadside of 7, but "parity" with ships of similar throw weight is fair enough to prevent game-unbalancing.

So for a frigate to be packing a throw-weight like that and punching in the Full SoL weight-class with one less gun-deck... it's food for thought. I don't know how they converted them into raw numbers, but some of the data-mining that led to those numbers was research I provided.

http://threedecks.org/index.php?disp...w_ship&id=2402

[Northern Wolves]

I have only played the game a few times and when I glanced over these numbers I muddled the 'burden' with the firepower numbers, apologies.

It has got me thinking however about some optional advanced rules that take into account the hull thickness, framing, tons burthen, weight of shot and so on. A long time board gamer I have been customizing rules since I was a kid.

But I digress, let me get back on topic:

I got my Constitution the other day and the packaging was perfect and I am really impressed with the captains cards, I really like the artwork they used. I knew I should have ordered 2 to start with, I have to have my Stephen Decatur in his USS United States.

We're in the process of buying a house and the new location has a really nice work bench/hobby area in the garage. I can't wait to set upon my 5 ship (and growing) fleet with the nice tutorials I have found on here. Ordering my ratlines now.

[Redcoat]

I have finally received the HMS Victory !!! It will be my next project.

[7eat51]

I have finally received the HMS Victory !!! It will be my next project.

Can't wait.

[Gunner]

I have finally received the HMS Victory !!! It will be my next project.

I'm keeping an extra untouched Victory until I see your project.

[Bligh]

I am agog with interest Julian.
These projects go a long way to keeping up the interest, by showing us what we can do with the limited resources at our disposal in this side of the hobby.
Rob.