Would You Participate in a Kickstater for a War of 1812 Expansion?

[7eat51]

From a marketing perspective, I would choose pirates over 1812, regardless of anniversary tie-ins. I think the broader public is familiar with pirates and not with 1812. SoG, like WoG, will attract general gamers and not just harder core historical wargamers.

From a personal perspective, I would love an 1812 expansion; however, I would like all types of expansions - Anglo-Dutch, Russian-Swedish, Spanish, etc.

[Coog]

From a marketing perspective, I would choose pirates over 1812, regardless of anniversary tie-ins. I think the broader public is familiar with pirates and not with 1812. SoG, like WoG, will attract general gamers and not just harder core historical wargamers.

Sadly your right. And not historical pirates. The public prefers Johnny Depp and "Pirates of the Caribbean" over Russell Crowe and "Master and Comander." Ares may should focus on phantom ships with ghost crews instead of HMS Surprise. That's where the real market is.

[7eat51]

The public prefers Johnny Depp and "Pirates of the Caribbean" over Russell Crowe and "Master and Comander." Ares may should focus on phantom ships with ghost crews instead of HMS Surprise. That's where the real market is.

Are we nerds, or has Western Civilization died?

[Coog]

Are we nerds, or has Western Civilization died?

Naw, not nerds. I've seen the hordes of nerds in game stores and they aren't playing historical war games! They can tell you about every aspect of many fantasy lands but not hardly anything about history or geography. And they are the intelligent ones in our society. Western Civilization is dying. Were not nerds, just Neanderthals.

[Cmmdre]

Naw, not nerds. I've seen the hordes of nerds in game stores and they aren't playing historical war games! They can tell you about every aspect of many fantasy lands but not hardly anything about history or geography. And they are the intelligent ones in our society. Western Civilization is dying. Were not nerds, just Neanderthals.

Actually we're ahead of the coming trend. I've got a keen sense for these things.

[John Paul]

It would be far to difficult for me to pass up on anything dealing with the War of 1812!!

I'd probably start another war just to make sure they make ships for the period!!

[Gunner]

Sadly your right. And not historical pirates. The public prefers Johnny Depp and "Pirates of the Caribbean" over Russell Crowe and "Master and Comander." Ares may should focus on phantom ships with ghost crews instead of HMS Surprise. That's where the real market is.

I hope those are your thoughts and not Ares.

[Berthier]

Sadly your right. And not historical pirates. The public prefers Johnny Depp and "Pirates of the Caribbean" over Russell Crowe and "Master and Comander." Ares may should focus on phantom ships with ghost crews instead of HMS Surprise. That's where the real market is.

Edward Scissorhands vs The Gladiator. See it at a theatre near you next holiday season.

[RichardPF]

From a marketing perspective, I would choose pirates over 1812, regardless of anniversary tie-ins. I think the broader public is familiar with pirates and not with 1812. SoG, like WoG, will attract general gamers and not just harder core historical wargamers.

From a personal perspective, I would love an 1812 expansion; however, I would like all types of expansions - Anglo-Dutch, Russian-Swedish, Spanish, etc.

I would guess that Ares is thinking that since the majority of the SGN business (and maybe all of their business) is coming from the US, and the closest cronological war to the Napoleonic era involving the US was the war of 1812, that should be their next stop.

While I will no doubt be a buyer of the 1812 ships, I would be a more enthusiastic buyer of the ships of Henry Morgan, William Kidd, Bartholomew Roberts, and Edward Teach.

In that regard, I think that to do the Black Pearl would cost more money in licensing fees than Ares could ever, to pardon the expression, swing.
It would also be a ship for which I, with my anachronistic tendencies, would have no interest.

[7eat51]

I would guess that Ares is thinking that since the majority of the SGN business (and maybe all of their business) is coming from the US, and the closest cronological war to the Napoleonic era involving the US was the war of 1812, that should be their next stop.

While I will no doubt be a buyer of the 1812 ships, I would be a more enthusiastic buyer of the ships of Henry Morgan, William Kidd, Bartholomew Roberts, and Edward Teach.

In that regard, I think that to do the Black Pearl would cost more money in licensing fees than Ares could ever, to pardon the expression, swing.
It would also be a ship for which I, with my anachronistic tendencies, would have no interest.

As a new game, I would advise Ares to start with the broadest appealing lines. The last thing any of us need is for ships to sit on store shelves. There is a large box of WWII WoW planes at our FLGS. I have offered to buy and send them worldwide to Aerodrome members, and the store owner gave me a deal at $7 per plane. Only a half-dozen folks requested any, and most were the WWI planes or two models of WWII fighters. The rest are sitting at the store collecting dust. Furthermore, once the bug bites, general players might have more inclination to learn and care about other AoS historical periods.

I, too, am out on any fantasy-related ships. I just saw a tactical WWII kickstarter that has a horror-related stretch goal module. I really don't want to blend genres.

[RichardPF]

As a new game, I would advise Ares to start with the broadest appealing lines. The last thing any of us need is for ships to sit on store shelves. There is a large box of WWII WoW planes at our FLGS. I have offered to buy and send them worldwide to Aerodrome members, and the store owner gave me a deal at $7 per plane. Only a half-dozen folks requested any, and most were the WWI planes or two models of WWII fighters. The rest are sitting at the store collecting dust. Furthermore, once the bug bites, general players might have more inclination to learn and care about other AoS historical periods.

I, too, am out on any fantasy-related ships. I just saw a tactical WWII kickstarter that has a horror-related stretch goal module. I really don't want to blend genres.

Perhaps one of the reasons that I have never "warmed up" to the WWII planes is that it seems like whoever has been selecting the planes has gone out of their way to pick obscure low production and low impact planes in order to represent as many nations as possible.
If it was my decision, Me 109's, FW190's, Spitfires, Hurricanes, Mustangs, Corsairs, P38's, and Zeros would always be in productions. Producing anything else would be on a once in a great while basis in low numbers aimed at the collector of obscura (Fiat and Gloster WWII biplanes? What are they thinking?).
The WWI release selection may be tending that way as well (look at what is in Series 5 and the upcoming Series 6 and then wonder about the D7 rerelease).

Broadening the product line and selection is fine, but I think that if the first tier craft (of any line) go out of production and all that a new player trying to get involved can do is buy odd ball fringe items or pay $30 - $60 per item on eBay for old stock they will likely move along to something else.

OK, Rant over...

[7eat51]

Broadening the product line and selection is fine, but I think that if the first tier craft (of any line) go out of production and all that a new player trying to get involved can do is buy odd ball fringe items or pay $30 - $60 per item on eBay for old stock they will likely move along to something else.

I fully agree. It is hard to keep a business afloat, let alone grow it, without positive cash flow. Keep, as you say, "first tier" ships in production, and add to that limited runs of other ships. I think activity on the Aerodrome would support this. Many of the planes I see folks building on there are additional numbers of first tier planes they already have, but which Ares does not currently produce, for example Fokker D.VIIs. As a newbie myself, I have limited numbers of key aircraft because they are not in production, and I am not going to spend the money that folks are asking for them. I dislike the thought of having to build models of key planes/ships to play a game that already comes with its own minis. I can fully support building models of obscure ones, or building models just because I want to, for enjoyment's sake.

[RichardPF]

I fully agree. It is hard to keep a business afloat, let alone grow it, without positive cash flow. Keep, as you say, "first tier" ships in production, and add to that limited runs of other ships. I think activity on the Aerodrome would support this. Many of the planes I see folks building on there are additional numbers of first tier planes they already have, but which Ares does not currently produce, for example Fokker D.VIIs. As a newbie myself, I have limited numbers of key aircraft because they are not in production, and I am not going to spend the money that folks are asking for them. I dislike the thought of having to build models of key planes/ships to play a game that already comes with its own minis. I can fully support building models of obscure ones, or building models just because I want to, for enjoyment's sake.

Yes, I guess I just had a flash of a time somewhere in the future where the only ships available from Ares in current release were Danish, Russian, and Cornish Luggers.

It would seem to me that secondary/alternative suppliers, like Shapeways and $60 Goering D7's on eBay in this case, only come about when there is a significant market need that is not met by the franchise holder.

[Wargamer]

Perhaps one of the reasons that I have never "warmed up" to the WWII planes is that it seems like whoever has been selecting the planes has gone out of their way to pick obscure low production and low impact planes in order to represent as many nations as possible.
If it was my decision, Me 109's, FW190's, Spitfires, Hurricanes, Mustangs, Corsairs, P38's, and Zeros would always be in productions. Producing anything else would be on a once in a great while basis in low numbers aimed at the collector of obscura (Fiat and Gloster WWII biplanes? What are they thinking?)
OK, Rant over...

Well that may have some of it, but a large percentage of gamers, imho, declined the whole ww2 version of wings based on the switched scale. Looking at the basis of their rationale on switching from 144 to 200 scale, I would expect that their early jets would be about 1/600 and the newest jets around 1/1200 or 1/2400 scale. Sorry way too many people are buying the miniatures to game with and want them to look good on the shelf, which for most display types want the same scale for a given type - airplane, ship whatever. If Sails switches scales from 1000 to something else because they go to triremes or steam, it would be a no sale on my part.

[csadn]

If it was my decision, Me 109's, FW190's, Spitfires, Hurricanes, Mustangs, Corsairs, P38's, and Zeros would always be in productions. Producing anything else would be on a once in a great while basis in low numbers aimed at the collector of obscura (Fiat and Gloster WWII biplanes? What are they thinking?).

Probably "Everyone and his dog makes those -- the market's saturated with cheap minis of the well-known stuff; the only chance of selling our stuff is to go places the Big Guys won't". It's been argued before.

[Gunner]

Probably "Everyone and his dog makes those -- the market's saturated with cheap minis of the well-known stuff; the only chance of selling our stuff is to go places the Big Guys won't". It's been argued before.

Is that why there still sitting on shelves, and on sale by so many retailers?
I for one don't understand why Corsairs or even PZL 11's (were WWII started) were not put out. Just to name a few.

[csadn]

Is that why there still sitting on shelves, and on sale by so many retailers?

Yes -- at discounts which make me wonder how'n'ell they're staying in business. (And in some cases, I've seen the same models sitting on the same shelves for *years*.)