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So I got my broken mast first rates recently and couldn't wait to check out the record cards and see those giant broadsides..... only to see that they are the same as the 3rd rates from the starter box. I remember thinking "Can it be that my 118 gun Orient has the same broadside as the Genereux?":question:. Does this strike anyone else as weird? Especially considering how they maneuver like cinder blocks with newspapers for sails one would think that firepower would be their saving grace.
Good question. Don't know why the first two full broadside boxes of the Genereux/Aquilon throw out as much weight as the first two from the Orient.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiron0224
No doubt someone on this site will give you a good answer.:beer:
I had also noticed this.
I wonder if it has less to do with actual firepower, and more to do with sustainability of play. As the battle wears on the 74s broadside erodes faster than the First Rater and goes on further reflecting the extra guns. This prevents the knocking out of the 74 with a single punch. As we can see from many battles 74s often gave a good account over larger ships although they inevitably ended up as hulks by the end of the battle.
That is the only reason that I can put forward.
Rob.
It's also interesting to note that many French Temeraire 74's had a broadside throw-weight actually *greater* than many British First Rates. I'll see about putting my BSW Calculator on Dropbox and posting a link or something.
That is a very interesting bit of information DB.
It could answer the question in one fell swoop.
I have never even seen it mentioned anywhere before.
Thanks for that.
Rob.
One of the drawbacks of working purely off throw weight. To make any meaningful comparisons one needs to factor in rate of fire as wellQuote:
Originally Posted by Diamondback
Rate of fire is a separate rule. Broadsides should stand alone, independent of nationality or skill.
The same is true of the British first rate I picked up (Royal Sovereign). The other thing I noticed is that the other two arcs are much heavier in the first rates. So where the Genereux is something like 4 7 4 the Orient is more like 5 7 6.
Orient had a broadside weight of 1,376 per Three Decks, while Genereux (1785) threw 838.
The weight of the broadside of HMS Speedy was 28 so it is a wide spectrum and I think they made it a little bit logarithmic too.
The broadsides of the Sloops Swan and Fairy are 40. It appeared that Ares was taking broadside/100 rounding up or down. And this formula works pretty well until you get to the 1st rates. Perhaps they surmised on a huge broadside there would be more misses, miss fires, some ports under water, I don't know, insert reason here.
Perhaps "pounds per minute" or "per X-minute block" would be a better metric--light guns would fire faster but not have as great of penetration, while anything above 24# would be slower, 42's and 68's even more so. (I would NOT have wanted to be one of the guys stuck reloading Victory's monster forecastle carronades at Trafalgar!)
I guess that makes a bit of sense. From my simplistic point of view it just seemed a bit weird (also a bit of a let down in game terms since firepower seemed to me to be the main reason you'd bring one of those slow barely maneuverable pigs to the battlefield with you.)
Make "length of turn" equal "time to reload"; then give the British and Americans a re-roll opportunity....
I think this is a concession to the playability.Quote:
Originally Posted by Chiron0224
The French 1st rates had 36 pounders on the lower decks.
Like stated above: A first broadside is a first broadside. But if you transfer this to SoG, the 1st rates would be the dominating killers on the game board.
(my opinion - I like the Ocean class ships the way they are in SoG)
I have not played enough games yet to form a solid opinion about this question, but from what I have seen so far the big guns seem to come out on top in the long run, unless they are ganged up on by smaller vessels.
Rob.
Pretty much as I think they should be.
The first rates can actually survive enough to do damage if they try to break a line. A 74 loose firepower quicker when taking damage. That makes first rates better. It's not just that big number in the first box that matters.