2 vs 2 Frigate Action

They waited patiently to clear the islands and then the British made their intentions known.

Attachment 33920

HMS Sybille and HMS Amelia beat towards Carmagnole and Dryade. The wind is out of the north. “Let’s tell these French what we think of their encroachment in our waters. Oh and Mr. Pullings beat to quarters.” “Very good sir!”
Attachment 33921

Sybille fires the opening shot, a full broadside at Dryade causing light structural damage to ship and a loss of some crew. “This is HMS Sybille, consider yourself warned!”
Attachment 33922

Sybille calls for continuous fire as Amelia also targets the bloodied Dryade as she enters the fray. Dryade returns fire and hits Sybille causing minor flooding and a fire on board. Carmagnole is not in effective range yet. Sounds of cheering and taunts carry leeward from the Dryad. “Fire on us again and I shall taunt you a second time you pig dogs!”
Attachment 33923

Carmagnole looses a frontal broadsides against Amelia which also sparks a fire. Both British ships are fighting fires before they get out of hand. Dryade takes advantage of the mayhem and orders the gun crews to load double shot. “Sir! Aren’t we to keep our distance and only harass? Napoleon warns against close in action with the British, we must preserve the fleet.” “Ah, but what is more harassing, single or double shot?” “Let’s get on with it, helmsman turn leeward.”
Attachment 33924

Dryade’s helmsman steers leeward as the men frantically load the extra shot. Sybille’s guns fall silent due to actions of survival. Amelia’s cannons violently recoil sending smoke and solid shot flying towards Carmagnole. When the smoke clears visible damage is apparent above the waterline. Amelia’s Captain exclaims, “She will regret firing upon the Royal Navy. She means to close with us, let’s show her what we are made of men!”
Attachment 33925


Once close enough and in short range Carmagnole turns hard port but is mishandled and goes into irons. Once she recovers from the hard lean her broadsides torment the port side of Amelia smashing wooden debris into the crew that is battling the flames.
Meanwhile, Dryade lets loose a wall of deadly overloaded shot, the projectiles seemingly flying out of control before they deal their indiscriminate damage to the HMS Sybille, leaving her crippled. The French captain looked on with admiration for the Sybille as her captain rallied the crew and managed to fire the cannons still upright at Dryade smashing into her poop deck and maiming some officers near the captain. The captain yells above the thundering cannons “That’s enough! All batteries fire at will!”
Attachment 33926


The French captains realize that this fight could be over quickly with one more well placed shot and both order their gun crews to fire at will. Sybille’s bloodied crew take stock of her and repair what they can. They clear some debris from the gun ports and restore a cannon as a murderous hail of iron and wooden splinters rip into the gun deck killing men in mid-repair.
Meanwhile HMS Amelia sees an opening for a rake against Dryade and steers into the wind, using the ships momentum to line up a broadsides, hitting the already wounded men on the poop deck and killing the french captain where he stood, knocking him overboard. Carmagnole’s crew fires at will at Amelia’s port side but with little effect.
Attachment 33927


With the blaze snuffed out on Amelia, the port gun crews take aim at Carmagnole as both pairs of ships exchange broadsides. Sybille is fortunate not to take anymore damage as her men absorbs the punishment instead. “We must tack and rejoin Amelia or all is lost!”
Attachment 33928


Sybille goes into irons and presents a juicy target to Dryade but the new captain had ordered a full reload to then deliver a fatal blow. Amelia sees the potential for a future rake against Carmagnole and turns port while ordering all hands down to brace against the onslaught of Carmagnole. Once again the hurried French gunners seem to lose focus with the chaos of continuous fire.
Attachment 33929


Lady Luck is on the British side this round as both ships avoid significant damage. Carmagnole and Amelia collide as they exchange fire. Sybille gets the better of Dryade in their exchange.
Attachment 33930


Carmagnole and Amelia’s rigging becomes entangled. Amelia loads canister and calls for continuous fire, sweeping the decks clear on Carmagnole. Sybille makes sail back towards Amelia as Dryade wears and loads her sizzling cannons.
Attachment 33931

Sybille’s captain looks rearward at the looming barrels of the Dryade and orders hard to port. Sybille’s few remaining guns get their final shot into the side of her nemesis. Dryade’s cannons belch blinding smoke as rocketing shot breaks through the port side planking of Sybille. With cannons torn from their carriages and indescribable carnage strewn about the crew of Sybille lowers her flag and heads below deck to render first aid.
Meanwhile, Carmagnole calls for hard port to break free of the stinging canister shot administered by the Amelia.
Attachment 33932


Carmagnole heads leeward to gain some separation from their battle enraged foe. Dispite the damages endured from fire, cannon, and musket shot HMS Amelia loads what little functioning guns remain and rake the stern of Carmagnole, punching holes through the rear of the ship. The men let out a “Horah!! And That’s for the HMS Sybille!”
Attachment 33933


Carmagnole relalizes that to wait for Dryade would be a mistake and turns windward and unleashes her final broadside which fatally punctures the HMS Amelia. The Dryade and Carmagnole send a prize crew to the boats to see to the terms of surrender.
Attachment 33934

AAR writeup complete!

Very explicit AAR Aaron.
looks like you have a winner here. No pun intended.
Rob.

Is this a demonstration of having the weather gauge, or what?

Speaking of weather gauge, I read that with strong wind there are certain advantages bestowed.

* If you are leeward your cannons were elevated more due to listing over. The French preferred this as it supported their aim high tactic and gave them an escape path.

* the disadvantage was that the bottom of the hull was more exposed.

* advantage of windward was you control the engagement.

It would be interesting to explore rules that supported this? Say more susceptible to leaks but a boost in range or sail damage?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aaron

Speaking of weather gauge, I read that with strong wind there are certain advantages bestowed.

* If you are leeward your cannons were elevated more due to listing over. The French preferred this as it supported their aim high tactic and gave them an escape path.

* the disadvantage was that the bottom of the hull was more exposed.

* advantage of windward was you control the engagement.

It would be interesting to explore rules that supported this? Say more susceptible to leaks but a boost in range or sail damage?

---

"Fighting at Sea in the 18th Century" is a great book that someone recommended on this site. It goes into the advantages of the weather gage (the U was a later addition). Heeling was a minimal advantage as the ships were designed to heel less than the guns could compensate for. The main advantage was that a leeward ship would have to tack (turn into the red) to change firing sides, and a windward ship could wear, or jibe to achieve the same thing. Wearing was faster, and reduced the chance of being raked.

I agree with Dobbs yet again.

"Fighting at Sea in the 18th Century" is full of useful information, and states that the roll of the ship was much more used for an elevation or depression of guns than the heel of the ships.
However, in severe weather it could cause windward ships to be compelled to keep their lower ports closed thus drastically effecting their fire power.
Rob.

I will check it out!

Liked your AAR Aaron.

I enjoyed reading this, thank you.
Do you mind if I ask what software you used to write and illustrate this?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AndrewG73

I enjoyed reading this, thank you.
Do you mind if I ask what software you used to write and illustrate this?

---

Yes - I used software that I created that plays the game on your windows computer. The illustrations you see are screen grabs from the game as I played it. If you go to the General Discussion forum you will see a thread dedicated to my project. The software is free to use and is linked at the top of the thread software thread. This software is still in development so it is what I refer to as 'ugly' or 'buggy' but it will get worked out in the end.

Thanks Aaron. I've checked it out and it looks like a fabulous tool. :thumbsup:

I saw this report and thought it might be fun to try it with my ships, so this weekend I gave it a go. I used the HMS Sybille (38 guns) and HMS Orpheus (32 guns) against the Courageuse (34 guns) and Embuscade (32 guns). Here's my AAR:

Turns 1 & 2 : Per the scenario, British wait to attack until ships clear the channel islands. During this turn all captains beat to quarters and order their Marines to the tops in preparation for combat. Ships are reaching under battle sail, and begin to maneuver for engagement. Both Sybille and Courageuse hold fire at extreme range.
Attachment 37672

Attachment 37673

Attachment 37674

Turns 3 & 4 : British ships beating toward French. Sybille's forward port guns fire on Courageuse at B range, Courageuse replies with starboard forward guns bow raking Sybille at B range (just out of musket range). Orpheus and Embuscade exchange forward gunfire at A range. Courageuse takes 5 damage oints, a crew hit, and a fire started. Sybille takes 2 points including 3 crew. Orpheus 2 points, Ebuscade 2 points, 1 crew hit.
Attachment 37675

Turns 5 & 6 : Courageuse works to extinguish fire, all ships musketry, Embuscade full broadside. Courageuse attemps to grapple and fails.
Attachment 37677
Attachment 37676
Courageuse and Sybille take 2 crew hits each, while Orpheus takes 5 points damage including rudder and crew hit. Embuscade and Orpheus musketry results in all 0 chits being drawn (musketmen rattled by the intensity of the battle?). Ships separate while reloading and repairing.
Attachment 37678

Turns 7 & 8 : Sybille stern rakes Courgeuse at B range, both fire musketry (Courageuse receives 8 points damage including hull hit, rudder damage, 3 crew), Orpheus fires full broadside at A range on Couraguese inflicting 4 points damage, plus mast hit.
Attachment 37679
Attachment 37680

Turns 9 & 10 : Embuscade desparately tries to get back into the fight. Courageuse with rudder and mast damage has erratic movement. British try to maneuver to finish her off.
Attachment 37681

Turn 11 : Orpheus fires full left broadside at A range bow raking Embuscade inflicting 4 damage points plus 1 crew hit.
Attachment 37682

Turn 12 : Orpheus fires forward port guns at A range on Courageuse inflicting 3 damage points, Sybille forward starboard guns bow rake Courageuse inflicting 6 damage points, sail damage, and 2 crew hits --- Courageuse strikes its colors with 8 hull boxes full and 8 crew boxes full.
Attachment 37683

Turns 13 & 14 : Sybille closes with what is left of its prize. Embuscade seeing Courageuse strike and now outnumbered, goes to full sail and attempts to head back to the channel islands for protection. Orpheus stern rakes Embuscade with rear starboard guns at B range inflicting 11 points of damage (good shooting!) including 2 crew. Embuscade strikes to Orpheus.
Attachment 37684

BUTCHER'S BILL:

HMS Sybille -- 2 damage points (1 hull box), 5 crew hits.

HMS Orpheus-- 7 damage points (3 hull boxes), 1 rudder hit (repaired), 1 crew hit.

Courageuse -- 25 damage points (8 hull boxes filled), 8 crew hits, fire, rudder damage, hull leak, mast damage, sail damage. Strikes to HMS Sybille.

Embuscade -- 17 damage points (8 hull boxes filled), 3 crew hits. Strikes to HMS Orpheus.

This scenario was sure a lot of fun to play. It resulted in an overwhelming British victory after they had a bit of a shaky start. Definitely recommend you give it a try.

Very interesting contrasting these two scenarios Bill.
AS bit of extra luck and placement of your ships and a different result.
I enjoyed following this action.
Thanks for sharing it.
Rob.

Bravo. I viewed the pictures. Tomorrow I will read the text over as 4am comes early.

Very good fights, both of them!

About listing I have to say that I was a bit surprised at how little the brig La Grace listed. At 15 knots wind at 90 degrees she was completely straight in the sea with fore staysail, fore course, fore top sail, fore top gallant and main staysail set. It was up to 17 in gusts and if it had increased over to 20 we were told to fall off. That brig was built from af Chapman’s drawings of about 1775. More modern sailing boats and my experience from the brig Tre Kronor of a design from about 1840ies are that they list very much more but are of a more stable design. That is, the shape of the hull makes them less prone to turn into the wind when listing and get more “lift” on the leeward side from the listening.

By the way... I’ll mention it again as I learned it by doing the same mistake, only the center arc can rake.

"By the way... I’ll mention it again as I learned it by doing the same mistake, only the center arc can rake. "

Thank you !!! I've just learned something new about the game !!! :thumbsup: (wanna bet I'll forget and do it again in the next AAR I file ???)

Very informative and interesting demonstrations. I too had completely missed the ‘raking by centre arc only’ .

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TexaS

About listing I have to say that I was a bit surprised at how little the brig La Grace listed. At 15 knots wind at 90 degrees she was completely straight in the sea with fore staysail, fore course, fore top sail, fore top gallant and main staysail set. It was up to 17 in gusts and if it had increased over to 20 we were told to fall off. That brig was built from af Chapman’s drawings of about 1775. More modern sailing boats and my experience from the brig Tre Kronor of a design from about 1840ies are that they list very much more but are of a more stable design. That is, the shape of the hull makes them less prone to turn into the wind when listing and get more “lift” on the leeward side from the listening.

---

Jonas, I think you're confusing listing and heeling. When the wind blows and a ship heels, that's natural. When a ship lists, something is wrong.

Warships of this time period were designed to stay more upright than modern ships. They sacrificed of their ability to go to windward to match the angle of heel to the elevation capabilities of the gun carriages.

Yes. It's a confusion of words. It was almost midnight and we work 50 hour weeks right now.

But still, they were very more stable, something I find modern artists and movie makers don't know.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TexaS

Yes. It's a confusion of words. It was almost midnight and we work 50 hour weeks right now.

But still, they were very more stable, something I find modern artists and movie makers don't know.

---

That is a fine observation. Is there a Line drawing for the brig? I could run it through my designer and get the righting moment arm curve for the hull form. The biggest unknown would be the vertical center of gravity placement.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wentworth

"By the way... I’ll mention it again as I learned it by doing the same mistake, only the center arc can rake. "

Thank you !!! I've just learned something new about the game !!! :thumbsup: (wanna bet I'll forget and do it again in the next AAR I file ???)

---

I made the same mistake on my early games and even had to correct my app to preclude frontal/rear arc rakes.

For your presentation/photos- comparing/contrasting them to mine, it would be nice on your table to annotate the traveled path in a form of a wake to aid in the sense of motion/direction. I don’t know how practical that would be. Like maybe, small beads or colored wooden tooth picks left at the conclusion of each movement card placement.

Just an idea.

This is all very educational gentlemen. Having only assisted in building and sailing a mirror dingy when I was about 15 I know very little about the finer points of sailing. it will make my reading of stories about ships and the sea very much enhanced knowing a bit more about the reason for the design of the ships, rather than just keels vs sails, and weight distribution.
Little did I realize what I was getting into when I started sailing those little plastic Ares ships.
Thanks once more.
Rob.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aaron

That is a fine observation. Is there a Line drawing for the brig? I could run it through my designer and get the righting moment arm curve for the hull form. The biggest unknown would be the vertical center of gravity placement.

---

It's based on a brig drawn by Fredrik Henrik af Chapman. I'd guess it's from the Architectura Navalis Mercatoria. You could see if you can find anything from that or about La Grace generally.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aaron

I made the same mistake on my early games and even had to correct my app to preclude frontal/rear arc rakes.

For your presentation/photos- comparing/contrasting them to mine, it would be nice on your table to annotate the traveled path in a form of a wake to aid in the sense of motion/direction. I don’t know how practical that would be. Like maybe, small beads or colored wooden tooth picks left at the conclusion of each movement card placement.

Just an idea.

---

Interesting idea...have to give some thought as to how to do it....I am somewhat creatively challenged....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wentworth

"By the way... I’ll mention it again as I learned it by doing the same mistake, only the center arc can rake. "

Thank you !!! I've just learned something new about the game !!! :thumbsup: (wanna bet I'll forget and do it again in the next AAR I file ???)

---

You know during the game I actually had the thought..." there seems to be a lot of raking going on..." but of course I attributed it to my superior and outstanding play rather than my rules misinterpretation!! :wink:

I did it too. My mistake was with my soloplay character Captain Wentworth. :happy:

https://sailsofglory.org/showthread....nerves-of-iron

I updated the wording but the chits still show the error. :sly:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TexaS

I did it too. My mistake was with my soloplay character Captain Wentworth. :happy:

https://sailsofglory.org/showthread....nerves-of-iron

I updated the wording but the chits still show the error. :sly:

---

And here I thought I was being unique taking Wentworth for my "handle" on this site....ah well....good to see another Jane Austen fan though....

Indeed!

All the characters in my 2015 and 2016 campaigns had their names from Jane Austen characters.