Tournament Play
I'm with you on tournaments. I'm a scenario player. But I think designing the game so that it also appeals to the tournament crowd has added to its success. Just look at the crowds that flock to games that are played in a tournament format.Originally Posted by Nightmoss
I agree. I enjoy both scenario and competitive-tournament formats of play, and I wish Sails was a bit more tournament-friendly so as to add to the buzz...
I have been a bit amazed by tournament play the past few weeks. A friend bought the FLGS in our area. Sue and I have been helping organizing Magic cards, and generally hanging out some at the store. Most evenings, I see people playing Magic, Heroclix, or some other game via tournament play. As I learn about the various tournament styles, I must admit to being impressed, to the point that I wondered about doing something similar with SoG and WoG, where each person signs up, pays a registration fee, and is given a plane or ship that they can use that evening, taking it home with them. Whatever the tournament price is over the retail price of the planes/ships can go to a prize, or better yet, a charity. The nice thing about a charity is that such funneling of funds could help create a more collegial atmosphere among the tournament players.
For me personally, the best part about playing with others is playing WITH others. I am not concerned about playing AGAINST others. This does not mean I won't play hard or wisely, but the goal is not victory as much as it is enjoying the playing WITH another. I am beginning to think there is a way to structure things so one can have both - a competitive tournament and camaraderie with others. Maybe it will require a sign that says alpha gamers will be neutered in the process.
“You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation.” ― Plato
I don't mind tournaments but like you jim, I play for fun and relaxation. I will never understand people who talk, live and breath for a game. Too much more to life, and so little time.
Up until a couple of weeks ago, I thought the same thing. Now, I think I am beginning to see that for some folks, their game is all they have outside of the business of life. I am beginning to handle those who are "ate up" with their game with a bit more grace; what I still have difficulty with are those who are gaming bullies, if you will. When I see arrogance at the table, part of me says it's time to drop them a peg or two, which, in some ways, is arrogant on my part. I am starting to see the difference between enthusiasm and ego.
I think one of the things I like so much about logging on here is that I don't feel like I am on a gaming site as much as I am visiting with friends for a bit each day, part of which is discussing the game. For some, I know, that probably drives them away; for me, it keeps me coming back.
“You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation.” ― Plato
Just to be clear I think organized play for any game is fantastic! It engages the existing community, brings in new players and provides momentum for a game to move forward. So in that regard I don't mind tournament play when you're playing WITH the gaming community. It's what Eric described as the camaraderie of play. It's the flip side of this which becomes problematic for me.
The last time I engaged in organized play was when Wizkids was heavily into Mechwarrior. I wont go into whether the game was any good or whether Wizkids did a good job on managing their tourney system, but it was great fun for the local gamers and brought in tons of business for the FLGS. We had kids playing that were probably only 8 or 9, all the way up to old farts like me well into my 40s. Then out of no where we had folks showing up from Milwaukee and Chicago intent on winning as many games as possible against the local cannon fodder so they could claim multiple copies of the monthly prizes (I think Wizkids provided pins and prize mechs for each campaign?).
It stopped being fun, so I stopped playing and so did some others. It's never going to be my thing, but I'm not going to condemn those who enjoy serious tournament competition either.
Moving back to the OP a bit I agree with Fred and feel that Ares could benefit greatly if they pushed for more organized play (SoG and WoG). It might be tournament based or maybe scenario based? While providing prizes and such gets expensive, perhaps earning points toward the purchase of ship cards (Victory or Constitution), ships or other products from Ares could be the incentive to engage in some modest form of organized play?
Interesting history and cautionary tale on the unintended consequences of prize incentives. Heck maybe simple fun + bragging rights is where it's at...
This is why "participation prizes" with maybe a bonus for winners is better than a pure cutthroat "only #1 gets anything" system.
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Tournament Play
We have been discussing the (de)merits of tournament play on another thread. The discussion has me thinking about something like the following.
A Saturday tournament - a few hours at most - in which the entrance fee covers the price of a mini. As for a grand prize, I can donate an older WoW plane or some such thing. I am not too worried about such prizes because I don't want them to be the big driver. The goal would be to encourage folks to gather, play, and everyone goes home with something that builds their own collection. I think such events could be a great way to introduce the game to folks, assemble players who might not have a group with which to play, etc. I think there are many types of scenarios that could be run that would facilitate such play. Besides the upstairs tables, the basement - newly repainted and very nice - has a dozen+ tables, so we could easily set up a group of smaller skirmishes as well as larger games.
Any suggestions?
I will set this up once some solid ideas have been developed.
“You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation.” ― Plato
Sounds like a super idea to me and it is somewhat similar to what Ares did with their big Record Breaker event at GenCon.
Your fee covered the cost of a mini. There were nominal prizes for various accomplishments and everyone had a great time learning the game, sharing experiences and having a lot of fun in the process.
I think a very basic scenario is probably going to be best. Also allow the option of players returning to the game should they be eliminated prior to either a turn count or time limit? Prizes could go to the player who achieved the most victories, but I'd also consider giving a prize to whoever was defeated the most [perseverance should be rewarded :)]. Other prizes for unusual occurrences might also be offered?
Great idea to push for organized play.
This is why I never attend any tournament events -- it isn't bad enough the power-gamers descend from the rafters; sometimes they work in teams....
The other fix is to make tourney prizes all Uniques: "You may only deploy ONE of this unit", so there's no point in having more than one.
If SGN did tournament prizes, I'd suggest it be a small pool of them, same prizes available at every event for the year aside from maybe medals and trophies.
Or take a page from the British Naval General Service Medal, and each time you play an officially-sanctioned historical scenario and win you get a clasp for the "Game Service Medal," which comes on your first such win...
That would certainly work. Anything to keep prizes from showing up on internet auction sites.
The other rub is, there are a lot of us who don't have convenient venues for Organized Play or ready availability to travel for Origins or GenCon... so, maybe after a prize mini goes End of Life as an OP Prize, allow an opportunity for the rest of us to buy it direct before it goes back to the shelf to await its turn in the rotation again. WizKids did this with the original Spanish Main "Ghost Ship" LE's [EDIT to complete thought] and most of the character busts but never saw fit to continue it with the Ghost Crew/Treasure prizes, or the Crimson Coast OP prizes. The high-water mark I'd say was South China Seas where every player got a 1-card ship, but even the cardboard "crew variant" cards of Barbary Coast were better than the pure mercenarydom that followed in Davy Jones' Curse and beyond. (Three one-card ships in a pack, one each for envoy, winner and "envoy discretion"--nominally "best sportsmanship", and the only way you got prize support for your event was by selling cases of product. This is where I learned to cheat and really buy my packs by the case-lot...) [end edit]
I'm OK with prizes showing up in the secondary market, but we want to reduce the incentive for powergamers to Munchkin.
So, here's the write-up I'm starting to put together to propose to Ares:
SGN Tournament thoughts...
For simplicity's sake Tournament events should use Basic Rules, and be limited to one or two ships, or one ship and a shore-battery, per player.
For events like Origins or GenCon, I would suggest a format of having one or two pick-up-and-play leagues running all day, with a break in the middle for a daily "Marquee" event like a historical scenario or a Record Breaker.
Possible events:
1. "Identical Ship": Players face an opponent with an identical ship to their own, and don't know what they're playing until they're assigned a table. (Downside: Supply intensive.) Pure contest of skill and luck.
2. Points-based flotilla build: Player brings their own ships, and has a certain point limit to spend on ships, shore batteries and crew upgrades. (Note: In this case, Captain/Crew Ability Decks should be made available for purchase either at event or at the Ares Games booth.)
3. Objective-based: Player is assigned an Offense or Defense role in a scenario; winner is the one who scores the most points of their objectives. Swiss rounds, and whichever role a player has in one game they are assigned to the other next game.
4. Division-based "Blind Draw": Each player is issued a random ship, theirs to keep, based on what division they've signed up for. First Rate players will only face other First Rates, Third Rate players only other Thirds, and so on. Fifth is a problem because of covering everything from lowly Amazon/Concorde up to Constitution... so maybe multiple frigate divisions.
Structure: We definitely would need to use a round-robin, Swiss-rounds or points-based structure, so that players who lose early games aren't just summarily eliminated and have a reason to stay and keep playing.
On prizes: If limited-edition ships are among available prizes, they should only be available to registered players. There should be a finite number of different LE's, say one each for one wave, they should be available for an extended time period (say, a year-long "wave" of four), and should be restricted so that a player can only win one or two copies of each ship. We want tournament play to be fun, not just pure mercenary loot-chasing like WK's MechWarrior devolved into. Or perhaps a "league play" system where you have a flat "enrollment fee" per quarter and that quarter's LE comes as part of your registration package.
Last edited by Diamondback; 08-24-2014 at 19:48.
I like all of the proposed events and I think any of them would be well received at spots like Gen Con or Origins. My preference would probably be the 'Blind Draw', which might cost more to enter, but has the major advantage of players keeping what they are issued. So in that sense everyone gets a prize even if you have to pay more for it.
I get what you're saying about organized play being out of the reach of many folks, and they shouldn't be cut off from an opportunity of acquiring LE ships. So that's where the commercial secondary market can be of help to them, although maybe a place like the Anchorage "For Sale/Trade" thread could be given the chance to fulfill that roll?
It's obvious you know the issues that can hurt organized play (looking at you WK's) and will communicate those to Ares.
Or that could be another outlet, allow the Anchorage a once- or twice-per-year exclusive sale opportunity wherewe can buy the LE ships exclusively through Keith as a dedicated Anchorage revenue stream...
That or, have the Ares Warehouse just open up a For Sale Direct thread when LE's go End-of-Life... the important thing is, to me it's a point of principle that maybe winners get theirs earlier but eventually everybody who wants a whack at such ships gets one.
IDEA: Eric, can we get a thread split? Organized Play/Tournament/Convention Events brainstorming sounds like it belongs as the subject of its own thread...
Last edited by Diamondback; 08-24-2014 at 19:57.
I started one on Saturday: http://sailsofglory.org/showthread.p...ournament-Play
“You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation.” ― Plato
If this game goes to exclusive LE tournament prizes I'm done. I've had enough of the cut throat play with Herocix and Star Trek attack wing. I've watched a venue that had a large following for both games lose all of the local players to power gamers that come just for the exclusive prizes. One of the things I like about the Ares games is a lack of this. If this game goes down the same road I'm and will find some were else to spend my money. Why can't trophy's be prizes? Oh yeah because they have no resale value and that is really the only reason for having exclusive models.
On a practical note, I cannot see the day when Ares would produce exclusive tournament prizes - the cost to the company would be way too high.
On a personal note, I would not advocate for such prizes either. I am in full agreement about keeping the game friendly. Rules lawyers, gaming bullies, arrogant players, and alpha-gamers are menu items for me.
What I would like to do is participation prizes in terms of ships - fee covers ship. If there is a "grand prize" it is something that is donated, e.g. book, ratlines, extra counters, etc. - nothing that would be worth the effort to resell. I want to keep the focus on gathering to play, not on winning prizes. If need be, I would dispense with any grand prize.
“You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation.” ― Plato
I wouldn't have a problem with a prize structure like your talking about Eric. I think I'm just fed up with jerks taking games to seriously and ruining the fun for everyone else. I hate seeing grown men bragging about how great of a player they are because they just wiped out a 10 year old kids team. Unfortunately competitive prizes seems to bring out the worst in people, or just bring out the worst people.
Rob, you're echoing much of what I've said also, but I don't see Ares going this route. For one they're not big enough to afford that kind of support and I also don't think that's in their corporate mindset.
+1 ^
I think participation events without exclusives is the best starting point. Local gaming spots can facilitate this without a lot of support from Ares (beyond their stamp of approval of course).
+1
My own thoughts on this subject are that the 'Prize' is not the reason to play.
As an avid GM, I do like to give prizes, and I keep my eye open during the flea market sales and bargain bins, for likely items.
For example, prior to the actual release date, when we were using the 'shared' demo set, I ran events all weekend at the Hurricon in Florida. I gave away three prizes at three of the events. A book about Nelson at Trefalgar, a PotC special Ed tin set, and a GHQ 1200 scale 74.
These were almost no cost and while nautical in nature, really didn't specifically have anything to do with the Ares line.
My point being, it doesn't have to be grand, just a recognition to enhance a good experience, and lock in the interest to the period.
(I understand that all three recipients are now well into the period, so that makes me happy.)
My style is to go for the MVP of the game and it is based on how the gamer plays and their style and sportsmanship. I have tried this and it really works well. Get some gold coins, and as a player makes a great move or shows another player respect, helps a new player out, etc, I pass out a coin. It takes one or two, then everyone tunes in that there may be a prize. (That is another thing, I never advertise a prize, it is a surprise.) Try it, it gives a lot of fun to the GM.
I too would avoid the prize based tournament as I believe it sets up the wrong atmosphere for the game.
That's just my two doubloons worth.
Which leads me to suggest a refinement: a monthly or quarterly league, where the fee covers the cost of your ship and whoever racks up the most points between gameplay (note, this doesn't necessarily mean "pure win/loss" but I'm thinking more like Swiss style where a combination of the hull points you take off the other guy and keep of yours is your score for the round) and sportsmanship/MVP considerations (these points awarded by player vote or GM discretion--this would also allow a Munchkin Deduction for poor sportsmanship too, or just everybody but Munchkin gets the bonus). The problem here is, the folks like me who already double-tap everything... I wouldn't want to have to try to sell back my existing minis to avoid surplus piling up, and I'm not sure how many takers there'd be on For Sale/Trade. (This ties in with something below, maybe for League Play do a limited pre-release of the next wave a quarter before it's otherwise scheduled to hit shelves--that way you get an incentive to come in and play, but you're not getting anything that won't be mass-marketed.)
I guess part of the idea I was thinking there wasn't so much "something you can ONLY get by winning," but something where the "prize" is just getting a head start on access to that miniature before it goes more widely available--maybe a pre-release of a Wave where registered GM's with sponsoring shops can order cases a quarter or so before mainline release (you're not getting something nobody else can, you're just getting it a little earlier, much like KS backers were supposed to get ours before retail release).
Also, one concept I was big on in my Pirates and War at Sea days (but never really got a chance to try out, that was one of the things I had planned for an event before my Forced Retirement) was "trade builds" games, where you have to be careful what kind of beatstick you bring, because for every person you use it on they're going to get a turn using it on YOU in return.
I don't think there is anything for Ares to approve. Unless I plan on running a major major event, I won't even contact Ares. My interest is solely in generating a community of players in our area. I have little interest in anything beyond that regarding tournament play - basically, the participation tournament is simply a little spice to add to a game day. The only other type of tourney I would desire to participate in is if another member, say someone in Madison WI, puts together a group, and one day, we decided to pull our resources for a combined area event near a good restaurant.
Looks like a good criterion to me.
I also wouldn't mind doing something for charity, making the gift to it as a group-based grand prize.
Should I move these tournament posts to the new thread?
“You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation.” ― Plato
Funny thing... one of my old WAS shipmates owns a restaurant in Caen, and I've been told that if I can get The Horde to Normandy I have a standing invitation to run events at his place while there.
I think so, amigo. Also, Eric, you might note there've been some minor edits to that last post (right before the one I'm replying to) so it might bear reread. :)Should I move these tournament posts to the new thread?
I moved the tournament discussion from the Victory/Constitution thread to this one.
“You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation.” ― Plato
It's always enjoyable to read threads here when people start brain storming ideas. Has Ares ever expressed an 'official' position on tournament play for either Wings or Sails?
Pretty subtle suggestion, Eric!The only other type of tourney I would desire to participate in is if another member, say someone in Madison WI, puts together a group, and one day, we decided to pull our resources for a combined area event near a good restaurant.
I'll have to see what I can come up with. Not too many players I know of around here? Milwaukee or Rockford might be better spots for an organized SoG event?
My personal experience comes from the A&A naval miniatures. In that context, I thought the tournaments were great--that community seems pretty laid back, egos stayed in check, and there was comparative restraint as far as "power gaming" goes. I would anticipate similar things of Sails players.
Also there never was any official prize support. That wasn't much of an obstacle, and of course it meant problematic prizes were never an issue
The AANM site has a slow but steady stream of online tournaments, which can take a while to play, and be quite big (> 20 players). Several of the highly active gaming groups also center most of their activity around mini-tournaments. And they have a bunch of people for tournaments every year at GenCon. All told, it seems like one good way to get people interested and motivated, though of course not the only one.
The question I have with Sails is how tournament friendly it is. For one thing, right now there isn't really any viable online option. But the bigger question is whether "real world" tournaments hold long-term interest?
It seems like a lot of the tournament-oriented games are heavy on the "build" element--meaning:
- each "army" (fleet, deck, whatever) has several units, offering chances for variety and choice
- units are significantly differentiated, offering a variety of complementary abilities
- together, these units allow "armies" to be built which can pursue one of several possible strategies for winning
I know a lot of people hate "builds." Taken to extremes, so would I. But it can be an added dimension to strategy, as well as giving more opportunities to plan and prepare before the tournament (and to endlessly kibbutz). In Sails, by contrast, the fleets are very small, the units are undifferentiated, and there don't seem to be too many different approaches to winning. Does that leave enough room for tournament play to remain appealing?
To take it to an extreme, if every game in the tournament was "on equal terms" frigate vs. frigate with basic rules, wouldn't that get old fast? But how much scope and variety can you add on top of that within the Sails framework, and still have manageable tournament games?
EDIT: rereading this, I see I cast it in fairly negative terms, but it's not really my intention to shut down possibilities. Rather, I do think it's important to be realistic about the issues, and hopefully to spark ideas that haven't occurred to me, for how to spice up the basic tournament structure...
Jim, I have not heard anything from Ares regarding tournaments. I doubt it is on their radar. WoG has been around long enough, and they have developed a decent enough point system for the planes that if they wanted to run tournaments, they probably would have done so already.
Fred, I think given the nature of the tournaments I would want to run, I could easily envision most any type of scenario, including shore parties, etc. Points could be awarded for various actions. Even Erin's race idea could work, especially if one is not tied to historical reenactments. I might run some type of round robin dueling once in awhile. When one is focusing on local tournaments oriented toward gathering and having fun, I think the possibilities are quite broad.
“You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation.” ― Plato
Can I get an "amen", brothers and sisters?
As someone pointed out: It isn't just the one-off prizes which are the problem -- there is a certain subspecies (in more ways than one) of gamer who takes pride in "d***-waving" about his tournament successes. I ran into enough of those in the '90s, if I see the word "tournament" attached to a game, I walk. (My personal favorite was the computer-programmer with the $90K/year job who still lived in his parents' basement rent-free, and spent all of his disposable income on _Magic_ cards; it was illustrative when he got suckered into a "sealed deck" event, and got his a** handed to him repeatedly.)
No Tournaments -- not today, not tomorrow, not ever, *NEVER*.
I just ran a Flames of War tournament. Here is how I worked the prizes:
It was a $15 entry fee. I had a 2012 Nationals tournament objective prize. I just never used it. But...it goes for something like $50 on Ebay.
We had (12) players.
Every player got a $10 gift certificate to the store we held the event in. This left $60 left over in entry money.
I then gave the top player a choice of an additional $20 gift certificate or the Kelly's Heroes tank mini. If he didn't take it, it goes down the line of choice.
Top Allied, Axis, Africa and Eastern Front players would each get an additional $10 gift certificate.
If anyone chose the mini, their gift certificate prize would go the lowest scoring player as encouragement.
The top Axis player finally took the mini.
So...all the entry money ultimately went to support the store, and everyone got the effect of hardly having spent any money on the event at all as they pretty much got paid back to buy stuff they wanted.
I like the idea of the gift certificates. Very cool tournament way of handling prizes, Andy.
“You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation.” ― Plato
Sounds like it worked to everyones advantage and you can't knock that.
That does indeed sound like an excellent way of doing things. As I recall there was something similar when the Time of Aces tournament for Wings of War was run in Cardiff - the entry fee paid for a T shirt for everyone plus some extra that winners could spend on WoW items in the shop.
For more "informal" events at local shows Chris has knocked up some medals on stickers that are awarded to players. Its not much but as a fun way of saying "thanks for playing" it is effective and lets participants show off to their friends :)
Same here -- if prizes are to be handed out, make sure it isn't something the winner can "lord over" others for.
Mr. Manley reminds me: There's a fellow in SF Fandom who runs a parody of the old _Match Game_ game show called _Match Game SF_. For folks who don't win the Big Prizes, he hands out badge ribbons reading "_Match Game SF_ Lovely Parting Gift".... :)
Also, perhaps variant Ship Logs might be an affordable and acceptable Participation Prize, if Ares were to produce them. What I'm thinking here is, one Ship Log per month, then at the end of the year all twelve get released for general sale as an Additional Logs accessory pack--once again, the idea is you're not getting anything nobody else can, just getting access to it earlier--an incentive to show up and play rather than powergame, more like the old Axis & Allies Combat Zone where everyone who showed up got an exclusive terrain tile, scenario card or documentation and variant-paint miniature from the current set than MechWarrior and the late days of Pirates where "there's only one and it's every man for himself to get it".
Some unique perks for Harbormasters (gotta have our own name for GM's too, right?) would be nice, but again, it shouldn't be something nobody else will ever get, just something they get earlier--like maybe for OP Variant Logs, give them the next month's log a month early so they can show the crew what they're getting next month and give 'em something to look forward to. You're not going to see a lot of variation in stats for a re-card of an existing class with a new name, so that's one thing I'm counting on to geld the Munchkins a bit... but still something where OP participants can tell their non-participant friends "hey, look what you get if you just show up and play a game with us."
Last edited by Diamondback; 08-26-2014 at 15:52.
Putting aside the tournament discussion for a moment I think the ship log idea might be a great seller for Ares beyond the miniatures themselves if priced appropriately? We have existing sculpts that could be used for other nations ships, we just lack the base cards and ship logs to fight the battles? Printing anything in paper/cardboard will be much easier than prepping for plastic miniature production?
Now back to the tournament and ship logs idea, this might be something Ares itself could consider for their Record Breaker event at Gen Con or as participation gifts for events at any of the shows where they attend in an 'official' capacity?
Something like the HMS Egmont ship log for instance?
I've suggested variant logs to Ares, and while I'm not at liberty to give details they did acknowledge that the idea has a place for certain situations.
Here's the rub, reflags we have to be careful with--yes, the RN took others' ships by the job-lot, but not everything they took joined the fleet--many prizes were hulked immediately on purchase, just as many went straight from Prize Court to the breakers. There are only two more French-flag Slade 74 reprints possible, Annibal (ex-HMS Hannibal) and then the well-before-anything-else-in-game ancestor Invincible herself. Concordes, all of the British reprints left are from the sculpt-stretch pool--Courageuse was also taken, but she's one of those "Immediately Hulked" cases and thus is worthless in game terms. I'm actually in the process of purging the Direct-to-Hulk entries from my reprint spreadsheet... and speaking for myself though I get the sense that there is some agreement, I'm reluctant to stretch an existing sculpt to pass for another country's design without some documented engineering relationship. (SGN104 as Triokh Sviatiteleis and SGN108 as Ches'mas I'm cool with because I know there was technology transfer between London and Moscow to build them, ditto the involuntary tech-transfer of back-stretching certain British ship sculpts to represent their foreign ancestors.) Call me overconservative, but I'd rather start with tight limits early and loosen later than crank out a swarm of stuff with an "OOPS" sneaking into the mix.
Re Egmont: we want to GELD the Munchkins, not ENCOURAGE them! LOL On a non-scrolling map your only choice is get a bunch of buddies together and gang up on the player with Egmont...
Stupid question, how many of us here have been GM's under formal, company-sponsored Organized Play programs before and what games? I was GM on WK Pirates, and was working on becoming so with WOTC Axis & Allies Miniatures for a time before the deal fell apart...
I would think the number of 'company-sponsored' GM's here to be quite small. GM's outside of company affiliation I imagine could be pretty numerous.
Jim, part of why I ask is hoping that folks involved with other OP lines that had creds could chime in with what worked and what didn't from their various experiences.
As much as I would like prizes supplied by Ares, I don't think Ares would do anything like the ship logs because the cost to print, send to GMs for tourneys, and refrain from putting them out to the general public would be too high for the amount of tourneys that would be run. I think when it comes to prizes, we're talking about GM/store supplied.
I am going to set aside a large empty bin and start collecting prizes for WoG and SoG - books, models, etc. - basically anything I can find on the cheap. These along with participation prizes will fill my needs.
I need ideas for different types of tourneys regarding the actual games.
“You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation.” ― Plato
Eric, part of the AAM model was, the store bought a 12-pack prize-support kit from WOTC, limit of four packs ordered per month. So there was still revenue in it for the publisher, and the store could charge whatever fee they liked for events to defray that cost. That's one of the things I'd suggest, having that part run by the LGS.
I'm also going to suggest some ideas for possible download-and-print GM documentation prizes, like say commissions, that maybe the Ares graphics folks could work up as an "official game resource". Something in this case like an MS Word or PDF-with-fields template where the GM fills in the new player's name, his or her own, dates, etc., hits "Print," signs on the relevant line and hands it over.
Understood and I hope they do speak up.
Hey DB, not to sound cynical or contrary, but I am having a hard time imaging Ares doing much to support tournament play run at LFGS. To my knowledge, they haven't with WoG, and with expanding into new game lines, I just don't think they will utilize their limited manpower for such a small venture. I would be surprised, albeit pleasantly, if they would even do the graphics idea you pointed out. I think all such resources will be developed by members here. Saying this is not an indication of belief that Ares does not care, but that they don't have the resources. I imagine GD will have a significantly larger market than SoG, and as such, would probably receive more of the type of help and participation of which we are speaking. One thing I think would be worthwhile is to receive permission from Ares to use some images for things like graphically oriented prizes.
“You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation.” ― Plato
In past experience with tournie based play (without prizes), id say there is little chance of stopping the odd munchkin turning up.
Some of them just seem to get a buzz from stomping folk.
A thing that worked was having a sheet per player with fun targets to try and achieve, such as, win a game by killing all enemy crew or other sometimes silly things.
Good idea, Steve, and good point Eric--part of why I was thinking "paper" was that that way it could be digitally distributed, no cost in time or management beyond the initial content-creation. Even variant logs could be printed by the GM on heavy cardstock, then the pieces cut out, glued and joined together by either GM or player.
Hmmm... that could be another idea, "achievement" medals and ribbons.
Awards can be for positive and negative things for fun.
500 crew killed in one game
2 ships captured in one game.
Ship dismasted in game.
Game won by ramming.
Etc etc
If the odd point is awarded for these things or similar you can help mitigate the play to only win mongers.
Of course, we gotta have a game version of the Darwin Award... "for eliminating your own ship from the battle in most spectacular fashion."
I like it. That way I know that I'd get at least one award.
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