Which Naval rules do you play with most often?
Naval rules
Which Naval rules do you play with most often?
WS&IM by avalon hill
Wooden Ships and Iron Men and modified Fighting Sail.
Form Line of Battle 2 for general actions
My own fast play set for big fleet actions when I don't have much time
A historical variant of "Man o War" for small ship actions
WSIM and occasional Frigate (SPI)
Huh -- someone else has a copy? Thought I was alone out here....Originally Posted by Berthier
oh boy, bring back the old stuff, Broadsides, Fighting Sail... but not quite as much fun as WS&IM.
I have a copy in a box somewhere. Haven't seen if for a few years though :)Huh -- someone else has a copy? Thought I was alone out here....
I've actually got two copies of Frigate...! You need the Moves magazine article to correct the small ship unit values to fix one of the major problems with the game.
Hm -- wasn't aware of the article. Know of any PDFs anywhere? (I guess I can ask that now -- it's been OOP, and the company's been DTE, for a couple decades now. :) )
here you go Chris, from Moves #25
Although I cut my teeth on WSIM, I have lately taken to Langton's Signal Close Action fast play. Paperwork is minimal, and they are great for getting into a good bit of action in a short amount of time. We only have about three hours to play on a weeknight, so these fill the bill. We were playing Trafalgar but the Dutch and English players couldn't accept that the Spanish could actually win!
Tell them it's not the Spaniards fault that none of the English players were named Nelson.
It's tactics, without sounding catty. Every fight the Anglo-Dutch would split forces, send one part sailing another direction while sending the other part headlong into the combined Franco-Spanish fleet. I guess there wasn't a Nelson there when they needed one!
Rob,
Excuse my ignorance but, why do you call the British fleet at Trafalgar the Anglo-Dutch fleet? I thought by 1805 the fleet (at Trafalgar) was made up of all English ships.
Ed
Oops...sorry for the confusion! I meant when we were playing the rules set "Trafalgar", not refighting the battle. Although those rules are not perfect, one of the things I like about them is that it's not assumed the Spanish (or French, for that matter) will always stink. My "Spanish" ally also rolled some rather good dice when his heavily armed ships let loose broadsides, which didn't hurt us either!
But anyway, that's what I meant, Gunner...the rules, not the battle.
Thanks for straightening me out. Not confused anymore.
OK -- now I just need to figure out how to download it. :)
" o/~ But we ain't/ Really quaint/ So please don't point and stare/ We're just Technologically Impaired... o/~ "
Don't feel bad Chris, I can't download it either.
Right click on the picture and "save image as"
I din't know about Chris, but it doesn't work for me. When I right click, the save as is faded out.
I'm using Google Chrome and it works fine. I've just tried with Internet Explorer and it doesn't even show the image (I'm only seeing the dreaded red cross in the box) so i guess its a browser issue? Happy to email you a copy if you want.
I'm using Firefox and it is easy to save, I can email to you as well if needed.
I think I have a copy in the attic; I didn't know about the MOVES article, though I probably have that too.
Karl
David, I'd appreciate a copy if you could - I use AOL and it does not want to come across at all.
I'll put a vote in for Rod Langton's Fast Play rules as well, obviously I usually default to Clear for Action for play but for those times when you don't have a PC to hand ...
If you have a copy of Rod's excellent (but very advanced) Signal Close Action rules you can take some elements of these and port over to the Fast Play according to your preference.
Best regards,
Mark Barker
The Inshore Squadron
Hey, Mark, I've heard of your rules but never tried them. Somewhere I saw they might be available as a free download? Free or not, how would one go about finding them?
thanks,
Rob
Rob,
Yes, that's right. CFA is a free download these days as the programmer (Malcolm Smalley) has given permission.
Malcolm is one of the founder members of the Squadron, credit where credit is due they are his rules not mine !
To get a copy (and this goes for any Anchorage member) just drop me a line at markvbarker@aol.com and I'll send you a link to download the programme.
It will run directly on Windows PCs up to Windows XP, later than that you will run it via a DOS emulator such as Virtual PC or Dosbox. I run mine through Windows 7 with Dosbox with no problems.
Best regards,
Mark Barker
The Inshore Squadron
Got it -- if no one minds, I'll see about transcribing it here later.
As we wait for the release of Sails of Glory, I was wondering what mini rules folks are using. I started collecting Pirates of the Spanish Main ships, and wouldn't mind playing some minis games. If you respond, please indicate if the rules are basic or detailed, if they are good for introducing others to minis, etc. I have been introducing some friends to Wings of War/Glory and they really enjoy the game. I wouldn't mind testing the waters with sea battles. Thanks.
Form Line of Battle - Basic, but with advanced rules that you can use to add more detail as and when you wish
I've been playing Wooden Ships & Iron Men using a hex marked sea colored mat with my GHQ miniatures.
Greetings David,
Are these still in print? I am trying to track them down.
Thanks,
EAT
Greetings Bobby,
Do you have to do much in the way of scale conversion?
Thanks,
EAT
Kiss Me Hardy by Too Fat Lardies
David, I saw that you have your own set of rules over on TMP. Are you using them?
Greetings Vol,
Is this more strategic than tactical? The game's website does not provide too much detail about the game, so any info would be appreciated.
Thanks,
EAT
Available from A&A Game Engineering:
http://www.aandagames.co.uk/form_line_of_battle.htm
KMH is tactical. There are precious few strategic AoS games out there.
I play with the plastc ships of the "pirates of the..." series with the original and some homemade rules (Wind etc.), captured from the net. And I w ill try rules like line of battle with these ships. But I´m waiting for Sails of Glory!
The first set of miniatures rules I bought was Warhammer's Trafalgar. I feel like I own the only copy in Idaho, if not, I'm likely the only one to have bought it off a store shelf here. :)
After reading the rules, trying to figure out how they arrived at the ship stats they had when comparing them to historical references, and playing a couple of games of it I gave up on it. I've never come to appreciate the Warhammer game mechanics, in any of the several periods and settings I've tried them in. I still have a hard time envisioning what a 200 foot long wooden ship would do to 'save' vs 900 pounds of iron shot coming at it from 100 feet away. The pictures were awesome though and I think that was the main attraction at the store.
I quickly moved to Rod Langton's Signal Close Action & the Fast Play version of that. I like the mechanics more, the core rules are VERY detailed, and the fast play rules are a good compromise between detail and speed of play. I also recommend his guide to painting the miniature. While not as flashy as the warhammer publication, I found it to be more complete and useful.
my 2 pence
Leif
Last edited by RedLeif; 02-14-2013 at 06:43.
None at all. The hexes on the mat are larger (one inch size) than the game's board hexes and the ships fit well in them. Thus no conversion needed. I'm just basically replacing the board with the mat and the counters with the miniatures.
Hello Folks,
Thanks for the rules replies. I will track down the different rules sets, but will heed the caution about Warhammer.
I bought several large Chessex mats for a roleplaying game, but on the backside are 1" hexes. I also have a copy of WS&IM. This should get me started, and when I have copies of other rules, I will be able to make any adjustments according to a given night's playing needs and audience.
You have provided good advice, and I am excited to start playing minis, as well as introduce them to some friends.
Thanks again,
Eric
I'd encourage you to also check out "Close Action" published by Clash of Arms and written by Mark Campbell. My understanding is that it was developed in response to the authors experience with WS&IM. It is also hex based, is convertible to a miniatures game (and has been done so by the author) and is still in print (along with several expansions). Unfortunately I've never played it but hope to some day. I chose not to pursue it due to the fact that it is hex based and the ship data seemed bit more abstract than I wanted. This abstraction is also a strength as it appears to allow the resolution of bigger battles and a player can probably more easily control more ships. The little combat simulation I did trying to learn the rules seemed quite in line with historical outcomes but as I freely admit I only took it for a test drive. If others have another impression (with game play experience) of this game I'd love to read it.
Leif
Sorry Eric, I was off line working on another ship. There is a good review of Kiss Me Hardy at http://lasthussar.wordpress.com/2009...ardies-review/. I heard some positive comments about KMH from friends on TMP and this review from The Last Hussar sold me. He says that "...after just 3 games both I and my 13 year old son were able to remember the fire mods." Very appealing since I am planning to play with my 12 yo daughter. The game is card driven like a lot of other games. Here are his overall ratings:
Presentation 7/10:- Cleanly laid out but you do have to print it yourself. Lacks a centralised QR.
Mechanics 8/10:- Nice and simple, though some rules outside of the main ‘Fire and Move’ feel a bit ‘afterthoughtish’
Clarity 7/10:- Again, the main parts are easy to pick up, but there are parts that can be read two ways, or not made fully clear, and some parts feel tacked on afterwards. The Lardies are always helpful on the Yahoo group.
Playability 9/10: Aside from the ambiguity in some rules, they are a nice, clean quick set that is fun to play. Easy to learn, and pass the “would play again” test.
Overall- 8/10: Worth buying, enjoyable easy playing game, but some omissions let it down. I would buy other TFL rules based on this experience.
David Manley, you didn't answer my question about your own developed set of rules. Are they ready yet? Are you using them?
Last edited by Volunteer; 02-14-2013 at 11:35.
Form Line of Battle is mine, its been available for nearly 20 years now. The latest version can be had from A&A Game Engineering.
The set mentioned on TMP is a fleet level set I've been working on. Its ages away from being finished - right at the top of the "funnel" of ideas right now.
Thats correct. mark and others believe WSIM is a "broken" system - I can't remmeber the details offhand - and many aspects are rather ahistorical. That said it was the first serious age of sail game I played and I still have my cherished copy from nearly 30 years ago.
Close Action is a lovely game that is as fast flowing as WSIM. Take a look in my albums and I think you'll see some photos I took at some CA games hosted by Mark Campbell in the DC area some years back. These were monster games with 30+ players. Those who understood fleet tactics and the need for simple, straightforward manoeuvring (and those who had drilled together) would generally do very well in those games!
Not "broken"; just really, really cumbersome -- lots of in-game arithmetic and table-referencing.
I've used, of all things, GDW's _Cloudships and Gunboats_, and _Ironclads and Ether Flyers_, to decent effect (the former for "small-unit" actions; the latter for larger battles and campaigns).
(Reading the review of _Kiss Me, Hardy_: Wow, talk about "combat Yahtzee"....)
Hey Leif,
I picked up Close Action and its expansions recently, but I have not gone through the rules yet; I have been reading the rules to Flying Colors. I will definitely check out Close Action sooner now. I must admit I am a bit amazed at how much has come out in the past 30 years - so many good looking games.
Thanks,
Eric
Thanks Vol. I like the thought of having different rule sets for different goals. This seems like it might be good for introducing others to gaming. I recently spoke to several friends about having them and their sons (all in grade school) over to teach them Wings of Glory. I would like to do the same with age of sail.
Hey David,
I just purchased a copy. I look forward to reading it, and will play a game in the coming week.
I might have some rule questions for you,
Eric
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